Victoria Brown (00:18)

Hi Gus and thank you so much for joining us on Story Slur podcast. I’m really excited to talk to you because I’ve had so many chats with you and I sense you’ve got a lot of stories to share. But first before… but I also want to pick you up in a minute on tea because…

Gus Bhandal (00:32)

Possibly.

Victoria Brown (00:42)

When I was doing my research about you Gus, I found out that you love tea but you hate coffee and I hate tea with a passion. I think it’s a lot of what’s wrong in Great Britain is people pontificating over cups of tea but I love coffee so I was thinking no how are me and Gus gonna get on if he hates coffee and I hate tea?

But then I read that you love Strictly and you hate jargon as well, is two things I can really get on with and agree with. So I think we’re going to be all right.

Gus Bhandal (01:16)

So yeah, I was just about to end the call and say goodbye. yeah, so I’ll start by saying hello and thank you for having me. Yeah, know, coffee is the drink of the devil. And you know, I tried it. I’ve got to be honest. I tried it when I was at university, you know, in place of like ProPlus and Red Bull. And I was like, no, no, I really, you know, I really need to start drinking coffee. It was absolutely disgusting. And I failed all my exams. So it obviously didn’t help. But yeah, I’m a big fan of tea.

I do agree though, I think there’s a lot of… And I do it myself, it’s like if I’m having some time to think, think, you know what, I’ll just go put the kettle on and all that kind of stuff. You know, I blame James Clear, who wrote kind of Atomic Habits, because when I talk to people about habit stacking, they would say, ⁓ well, make a cup of tea and then do something at the same time and stuff like that. And it’s like, well, who taught you that rubbish? Like, just why can’t you just make a cup of tea for the sake of having tea? It’s not like you have to add anything else, you know, while the kettle is boiling.

let me send a text or go for a wee or do the just like just make a cup of tea man and sit down.

Victoria Brown (02:19)

Exactly. And in my experience

people go and make the cup of tea to think about it but then forget what they were thinking about and end up only having the cup of tea. So that’s that’s why that’s the beef I have about tea as well as the taste of it which is disgusting. But anyway…

Gus Bhandal (02:26)

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah, I mean, yeah, but, I mean,

with your respect, you’re wrong, but I’ll be on that. I do know strictly,

Victoria Brown (02:40)

Yes, yeah, fantastic.

So I can’t remember where we first met. I think it may have been at your events that you run in Birmingham, which are amazing, by the way. But for people who don’t know you and so far only know that you hate coffee and love strictly. Could you tell us a little bit about who you are and what you do?

Gus Bhandal (03:00)

Absolutely. So my name is Gus. I run a business called the Guru and the stands for marketing. Incredibly imaginative, I know. I’m a husband. I’m a father to a seven-year-old. I live in Coventry, hashtag center of the universe. And yeah, I have businesses with marketing and social media, et cetera. And I run two events as well. So I run a LinkedIn conference, as you know, but also I run the SMM meetup. So the social media and marketers meetup, which is obviously where we met.

Officially, that’s where we met in person, but I’m sure like we’ve known each other for it feels like years online, right? yeah, so They were supposed to sound positive by the way, they were supposed to say you’re like an old friend rather than saying man You know time doesn’t fly when I’m with you that I didn’t mean it like that It was the opposite like I’ve known you for years because you know we’re mates. That’s what I meant

Victoria Brown (03:37)

No.

Yeah,

it’s so weird, isn’t it? You have these people that you kind of know online of and you don’t really know them that well and then you finally meet them in person. And I’ve got some people I feel I know really well and I’ve actually never met them in person, which is really weird.

Gus Bhandal (04:01)

Hmm. Yeah.

That’s the beauty of social media, right? That’s the thing. I think we get to really know, like and trust people. I think that’s the… Because obviously, and I think this is where social media comes in, in terms of… I teach a lot. So I normally tell my clients to be very personable and like create personable content, which actually gets people to know who you are and what makes you tick and all that kind of stuff. And I think you and I both do that rather than saying…

This is what I do for a living. Most people switch off to that kind of stuff. It’s all the other stuff that actually gets people to know us.

Victoria Brown (04:36)

Yeah, absolutely. So Gus, what’s your origin story then? How did your business start?

Gus Bhandal (04:44)

Interesting. Okay, so go back to the beginning. I was born in the late 70s in Coventry, blah blah blah, etc etc. I went to university when I was 18. I did a marketing degree and after that I kind of went into a marketing career. It was quite tough to get a job, but I eventually got one in a marketing setting. And then it kind of just went on from there. So I worked for some of the world’s largest companies such as Rolls Royce. I worked in the motorsport sector. I worked in advanced engineering. I worked for my local authority, I worked in retail, I ran a pub for a little while, etc etc. And running a pub was where I really learned how to run my own business. So I’ve got to be honest, running a pub was the stupidest thing I ever did. However, it was fun while it lasted, but it was… The bad thing was that I spent all day every day in a pub. The good thing was that it taught me a lot about how to run a business and what to do and…

And who I am and all that kind of stuff. So that’s when I started my marketing agency in 2017 so my origin story was when I left the Nobody would employ me because everybody saw me as a pub landlord and that was yeah, that that was the kind of And I just asked forget it. I’ll start my own business. And yeah, so I’ve been doing this ever since which is great because I I left the pub in 2017 around the same time that my son was born and then

running my own business means I get to be flexible around him and all that kind of stuff as well. yeah, that’s my story as such.

So Gus, were you always interested in marketing that? I’m kind of fascinated by whether people always knew what they wanted to do or whether they were a bit like me and I kind of went from one thing to another without really realizing what I was, although I was doing the thing I was interested, I’ve never really knew what it was, but I was interested by people who maybe knew from an early age what they wanted to do.

Gus Bhandal (06:42)

Awesome.

No, I’ve got, you know, it’s interesting because a couple of years ago I did a talk down in Dorset before the You Are The Media creator day and it was an event called Fail Night and it was basically about all our failures that we’ve ever kind of had in my life and in our lives and when I started doing kind of like writing the talk I thought actually this is quite a lot of stuff that has gone wrong so very briefly there’s a whole video on kind of YouTube about it on my YouTube channel

But essentially, when I was a kid, I wanted to be a fireman until my careers advisor just kind of, leaned over the table and he said, you know, turbans are flammable, right? And I was like, yeah, that’s a good point. So that prepared to that idea. So then when I was choosing my GCSEs, because I was quite good at French, I was like, I do French. This was around the time when Italian football was on TV. So then I thought, ⁓ I could become a French football commentator, pretty much like the Italian

kind of James Robinson I think his name was on channel four so I could so then I did French GCSE the problem was that I failed French GCSE so then I thought okay because I did history at GCSE I then decided I wanted to be a lawyer so I did history for A levels but then I failed history A level but I was doing the psychology A level so when I went to university I thought I’ll do psychology and then I went to university and then I failed a psychology module and I thought right this is you know there’s a lot of stuff, you know, I wanted to be a fireman, a French football commentator, a lawyer, a psychologist, you know, I’ve kind of failed at all this stuff. Flicking through the university prospectus, the only thing that was really left was marketing. And I thought, me try my hand at this. And it was for want of a better phrase, it came second nature. Like I started passing the exams and all that kind of stuff. this is this is easy. So some things come, you know, come well to some people. So, I never like nobody as a kid, one thinks

I want to be a marketer. And particularly when I was a kid, social media and stuff didn’t exist. you know, I graduated in 2001 and LinkedIn didn’t come out until 2002, for example. So then, but the marketing theory will always, you know, that will always be the same in essence. So, yeah, then I went into a marketing career, worked for lots of big organizations. I joined the Chartered Industry of Marketing. I did a number of postgraduate qualifications, et cetera.

and because I’m not going to say I found it easy but it was much easier than French or law or psychology and all the rest of it kind of thing so I I could probably make a career out of this.

Victoria Brown (09:43)

Why do you think that was?

Gus Bhandal (09:45)

I’m not sure. think that, you know, with with with the marketing in particular, I think there’s a lot that some of I don’t want to say some of it is common sense, because that would just assume that everybody is can be can be good at marketing. But I, you know, growing up, I used to love obviously, I love television because, you know, I was a kid growing up in the suburbs of Coventry. But I used to love adverts and I used to love advertising and all that kind of stuff. And particularly when I started psychology, there was a lot about

how people make decisions and why they make decisions. And I started really kind of getting into that, particularly on from the psychology angle that I studied. And so when I went into marketing, it was so much more than here’s a nice advert or here’s a nice kind of, know, strap line or something like that. I started looking into why people make decisions. because I did psychology as a minor as such, the two dovetailed really well together. So doing the marketing goal.

this is how we market to people, but then doing the psychology of this is why people make decisions. For want of a better phrase, I think that may be a better marketer in time.

Victoria Brown (10:58)

Yeah, of course, because it’s all about psychology, isn’t it?

Gus Bhandal (11:00)

Hmm. Yeah, very much so. think the thing is a lot of people don’t understand the like we all say anybody could be a marketer, anybody can do social media or that kind of stuff. And it’s not as easy as that. Everything relies on other people making decisions. And if you can somehow create a world where you’re influencing other people’s decisions, then your marketing becomes easier. And I think not many people can do that. Most people are just kind of

creating content or kind of writing marketing strategies that are very much like, well, I want to earn a million pounds in three years. And then you can say, right, how are you actually going to get there or how are you going to achieve that? It’s like, I don’t know, just post on Facebook. And it’s not, yeah, there’s so much more to it. But I think that as with anything, the decision making process, so the thought process of thinking of somebody else, thinking of the recipient is important. And I think that’s what a lot of people don’t do.

Victoria Brown (11:58)

Yeah, 100%. Absolutely. It’s what I’ve found as well throughout my career that people want, people have told that they need to create content. So they’re like, I need to create a month’s worth of content and but don’t really ask why. And they’re doing it in the first place. So and as we know, created content is a really hungry beast as well. So if you don’t know why you’re doing it, then you’re going to waste a lot of time making content. So it

Gus Bhandal (12:12)

Hmm. Yeah.

Yeah,

absolutely. I tell you, I see all the time people on LinkedIn partaking in 30-day content challenges. And it’s like, why? What does that? What’s that going to do you? You know, I’m going to post every day for 30 days. And it’s like, and what? What’s that going to be after 30 days? You’re just going to have 30 days worth of content. What does it actually mean? What does it mean for your business? The last person I saw do this, like on day 14 or 15, she basically said, I don’t really have any content. So here’s a photo of my cup of tea. And it’s just like,

And it instantly put me off this person. was just like, she was a copywriter. I’m just like, I would never work with you because that, I mean, A, you’re a copywriter, so you should have plenty of content. But also, that’s not content. And it doesn’t fit into your strategy. It doesn’t fit into your marketing and all that kind of stuff. I post a lot of inane content on LinkedIn, but it fits into a strategy. There’s a particular persona or kind of human led content and personable content that a strategy that I’ve created around that.

but it doesn’t include, here’s a cup of tea or coffee for example unless it fits into a strategy I just think sometimes businesses get lulled into a false sense of security just by creating nonsense online which is not how people make money basically

Victoria Brown (13:41)

Yeah, so if someone’s out there and they’re stuck in that I need to make content kind of thing, what would you say the first thing they can do, the first easy thing they can do to kind of move towards a strategy?

Gus Bhandal (13:55)

The I think well there’s a there’s a number of steps and a couple of steps that I’d normally talk to clients about is the first one is know what your ideal know who your ideal clients are obviously in terms of age, gender, demographic, all that kind of stuff. But then start thinking about their likes and their dislikes and all that kind of stuff. So that would be kind of step one. But then step two would be talking to their pain points. And most people create content that just provides a solution. For example.

I’m a LinkedIn trainer, I’m a social media manager, etc. That’s all great. That’s the solution. But what would be the problem? Why would people come to you? So then it’s kind of creating content around other people’s problems. So I would write content such as, you know, you don’t have much engagement or your content strategy doesn’t fit your business or you can’t find your ideal clients or you’re not making any money or, you know, your wife hates you or your dog’s going to leave you, you know, really kind of agitate that pain.

And then I provide the solution, say, well, you need LinkedIn training because of X, Y, Z. And I think a lot of businesses go straight for the solution. So my first port of call would be think about who your ideal clients are. But my second port of call would be think about what their pain points are and then create content that talks to those particular pain points. And it’s easy. Every business owner worth their salt should be able to do that kind of thing.

Victoria Brown (15:11)

Yeah, that’s a great tip. And I don’t

think it’s restricted to people in business. I think it’s a human thing because it’s something I used to see in corporate as well. So people would come to me and I’ve worked in comms and they say to me, right, I want an internet article on this. And I’d be like, but do you? It would really frustrate them. But I really want an internet article because actually only 30 % of our internet articles are read, let alone acted on. Actually, it’s much more effective to do this, this, this. And they’re like,

Gus Bhandal (15:28)

Yeah,

Victoria Brown (15:41)

Okay, and then we have to go back, okay, why do you want to? Usually, the most effective way of communicating a message was getting the manager to cascade it, which of course they didn’t like.

Gus Bhandal (15:50)

Hmm, yeah. Absolutely.

And I think using that example, you know, the solution would be, let’s put an article on the intraday kind of thing. That’s the solution and that’s the solution that you could provide. But actually, you then talk to their pain points and say, yeah, but what are you actually trying to achieve? Because there are better ways to achieve that outcome. And I think that’s, like I said, most people just kind of say yes to their clients. It’s like, you know, a client would say, right, this is what I’m looking for. It’s like, cool, I can do that. But.

It’s not necessarily what you need. The, like I said, the business owners or the people in the corporate world or, you know, business professionals, et cetera, they, you know, essentially they’re worth their salt when they can explain, no, this is, you know, here’s what your issue is and here’s how we fix the issue rather than just saying yes to what you think the solution is.

Victoria Brown (16:40)

Yeah, it’s just human nature, isn’t it, to look for those solutions, I think.

Gus Bhandal (16:42)

Hmm.

Yes. Yeah, yeah. And kind of following on from that, know you’re kind of so in terms of if people are struggling with content, the first one would be to talk to your ideal clients like their pain points, for example. But the other thing I always tell clients to do is to journal their week, particularly on social media is start telling the world, you know, what you’ve been doing because despite.

AI and despite what other people are doing and despite meeting people at events and all that kind of stuff, the only person that lives your life is you. So by writing, for example, by writing a post every Friday that basically says, right, on Monday I did this, on Tuesday I saw this person, on Wednesday I had pizza and all that kind of stuff. The only person that could tell that story is you, which then makes it unique, which then means that people understand who you are and what makes you different. So particularly when people struggle with content, that’s the kind of the two things I would say is create content.

about work that talks to your ideal clients pain points. And then the personable content could be just a synopsis of your week, which gets people to learn what makes you tick.

Victoria Brown (17:49)

Yeah, and I love that because not only is it simple, anyone can review their week. It’s also one, it shows, you know, you’re relatable because if you’re talking about what’s happening, which generally going to be relatable. And if you’ve done something like working with clients, it shows social proof as well that you are working in that field and know what you’re talking about.

Gus Bhandal (18:08)

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. mean, I wouldn’t write a post on Friday to say Monday, I did some LinkedIn training and then Tuesday I did some LinkedIn training and then Wednesday I did some LinkedIn. I’ll be really boring. It’s the bits in between where you would talk about, I did some LinkedIn training, but the client came from this industry or this sector and this is what we did and we went for a coffee or whatever it may be. And then the next day would be, you know, I bought pizza for everybody in the office. The next day would be, I got this testimonial, which I’m just, you know, topping and tailing for social media or whatever it may be. So it is that.

Victoria Brown (18:11)

Hahaha

Gus Bhandal (18:37)

subliminal messaging of here’s what I do in work but what makes me different from for example all the other LinkedIn trainers is all this other stuff that I do throughout the week which hopefully will turn you on to me as opposed to somebody else that’s the kind of the purpose of it yeah

Victoria Brown (18:50)

Yeah, yeah definitely.

And of course we know from loads of research that stories make you memorable as well so that’s gonna massively happen. And it’s interesting you talked about, I think you just mentioned being orange, well not that you are orange but that you have a lot of orange things.

Gus Bhandal (19:04)

I do, I do, yeah, and it’s, it’s, yeah, my, you know what, I gotta be honest, it’s just that I’m not orange, yeah, I’m more of a kind of a, bad cherry kind of thing, but you know, like a chocolate orange, I could say. but, you know, and don’t say I’m sugary and round, that’s not, that’s not what I meant, but the, is that element of…

What’s memorable and what makes people think? Somebody literally sent me a message yesterday and just said, whenever I see something orange, I think of you and it just makes me message you. And they message me all day, every day kind of thing. it’s that kind of congruence. And again, I talk a lot about orange chocolate or wearing orange trainers or the fact that my brand is orange and the purpose is because it’s warm and all that kind of stuff.

other people start remembering in their poems, putting the two together, etc. And also, at Christmas time, I get loads of orange chocolate in the post. So that’s great. If anybody wants my address, let me know. Yeah.

Victoria Brown (20:01)

a bonus. I need to affiliate

myself with some chocolate, what can I choose?

Gus Bhandal (20:05)

Yeah,

so to give you the longer boring story, which I’ll make as short as possible. Years ago, I used to do workshops with Terry’s Chocolate Orange and I used to teach people what this is. It’s all about segmentation and like picking different parts of your market and all that kind of stuff. So that’s where it originally came from. And then when I spoke to a branding specialist, when I kind of started my business, I talked about my logo, we chose lots of different colors and eventually I set it on black and orange because I was like, actually, this means something.

Victoria Brown (20:20)

Brilliant.

Gus Bhandal (20:33)

tells a story. the black is supposed to signify luxury and the orange is supposed to signify warmth. So it’s like the luxury is I know what I’m talking about and I’m an authority in what I do. But the oranges, I’ll do it without jargon or without kind of upsetting you or without kind of, you know, charging you massive prices and all that kind of stuff. So it’s the luxury and the warmth that kind of go together. But started from a Terry’s chocolate orange, basically. And so when I talk to businesses about affiliating themselves with something, it’s very much

Victoria Brown (20:57)

I that.

Gus Bhandal (21:01)

I mean, obviously it doesn’t have to be chocolate. It could be anything. Like one of my clients is from Yorkshire. So I tell him to always talk about Yorkshire tea and Yorkshire puddings and gravy and, you know, the Henderson’s relish sauce that you get up there and all that kind of stuff. And then it’s that people start creating that story around you kind of thing, rather than just saying, this is what this person does for a living. Because to be honest, anybody can do that, right? It’s all the other stuff that makes us different.

Victoria Brown (21:22)

yeah yeah

yeah i love that and it always reminds me of the best comedians with when i look at your marketing because you always have callbacks because you always have callbacks no but you know comedian always has like recurring themes in the in the stories they tell you do in your marketing and that’s what i was going to ask you about so like for instance the orange you talked about that pops up not only in color but also you’re talking about orange you’re talking about chocolate orange

Gus Bhandal (21:32)

Thanks. Yeah.

Victoria Brown (21:49)

Also, this thing about being the best LinkedIn trainer in the world, according to your mom, that comes up regularly as well. And I think that’s great because people see that and if they already seen the joke, they’re kind of like, yeah, we feel like we’re included in this, we get the joke.

Gus Bhandal (21:53)

Yes.

Yeah.

Yeah, absolutely. clarify, I’m the UK’s number one LinkedIn trainer. So I won’t go as far into the world. Although my mom is well-traveled, she hasn’t met everybody in the world just yet. But I am the UK’s number one LinkedIn trainer, according to my mom. the reason I told that story is because… So that started at, for example, a networking event. So there’s a networking event called Business Bars, and they do like a seven-second introduction round. So it’s basically…

Victoria Brown (22:09)

I’m sorry.

Gus Bhandal (22:33)

tell us your name, where you’re from and what you do, but it has to be seven seconds. So I went somewhere once and I said, right, my name is Gus, I’m from Coventry and I’m the UK’s best LinkedIn trainer. And I knew a lot of people in the room, so it was kind of jovial. And then somebody said, well, who says that? And I said, my mum. It just kind of came out and I thought, you know what, I’m going to stick. And people laughed and I thought, okay, I’m going to stick with this. And now we’ve got to the point where it’s got to the point where people repeat it back to me.

and they kind of they talk a lot about it and all that kind of stuff but also at the same time they there’s two kinds of people that see there’s two kinds of people that you will see online those that like that headline and think that’s really funny Gus is funny I’d love to work with him and then you get the others that say I can’t believe he’s saying that what he thinks that by himself or you know etc how can you prove that and then I’ll I always get DMs like can you prove that how is that quantifiable and I always reply and say if you could just contact my mom she’ll talk she’ll talk you through it

Now obviously my mum doesn’t have a LinkedIn account so that conversation always is not gonna ever go anywhere kind of thing. it’s the joviality that kind of attracts the people that like that kind of content to me. yeah, I do a lot of talking about that. And then obviously if I create content where there’s a theme, so I wrote a post recently which weirdly became one of my most popular posts ever about some samosas that my mum made me. And she said, I’ll make you one or two kind of thing. And she…

She literally gave me like a massive tub, there was like 20 samosas in them and I didn’t realize until I got home. And so in that post I said, my mom said she made me one or two. Here’s a picture of a whole massive tub of samosas. And just so everybody knows, this is the only time that my mom has ever lied. Obviously alluding to the fact that my mom thinks I’m the UK’s number one LinkedIn trainer. And some people thankfully got the joke kind of thing. like the whole point of that story is that’s absolutely right. There is those callbacks, those kind of those themes that run throughout

your content, your content strategy, your social media, your marketing, et cetera, where people start hanging their hat on particular kinds of content, whether it’s Terry’s chocolate orange or orange trainers or being the UK’s number one LinkedIn trainer or what your mom says or, you know, and all this other, what car you drive, what city you live in and all that kind of stuff. There’s lots of things that become recurring themes. And I think that’s what makes people memorable other than just saying, this is what I do for a living. Because to be honest, anybody can do that.

Victoria Brown (24:37)

you

Yeah and I love that because I didn’t realise the stories behind those kind of things that you say but I knew them and I think the reason they work is because there are stories and because it feels more authentic.

Gus Bhandal (25:09)

Yeah, absolutely. know, it’s kind of, you know, nobody can argue with mums. That’s the main thing. And to be honest, my mum couldn’t care less about my LinkedIn or indeed anybody else’s. However, but the point is that it’s a theme that becomes jovial kind of thing. know, Carlsberg very much, you know, their strapline, which has been for years, is probably the best lager in the world. And the word probably is very key because you can’t argue with that.

Victoria Brown (25:15)

Hahaha

Gus Bhandal (25:38)

because it’s like, the word is probably, but the actual strap line, what you remember is the best lager in the world. And it’s, don’t necessarily remember the word probably. So when I say the UK’s number one LinkedIn trainer, only about 70 % of the people recall the bit at the end, is according to my mom. Cause most people when they say, when they introduced me as well, have entered like, this, this guy’s the UK’s number one LinkedIn trainer kind of thing. And most people are just like, what?

Like how is that quantifiable? They don’t know the joke, if that makes sense. But again, like I said, it’s important to have that theme and stuff that goes through content where people talk about that kind of stuff.

Victoria Brown (26:17)

Yeah, and I love the way you’ve thought about that. I love also the way, fact, it repels the people that don’t get the joke automatically.

Gus Bhandal (26:23)

Yeah, yeah,

absolutely. And I think we should all do that in our content in terms of, you know, when I tell jokes, I mean, I have lots of people that come to me and kind of say, I like your content, but I don’t want that kind of content for myself. I want content that’s in inverted commas professional or, you know, that doesn’t have jokes and all that kind of stuff. And I’m like, My content is professional, but it attracts a particular kind of clientele, people that…

think I’m funny or people that want personable content or personality-led content, etc. So I think by that same token, does repel the people that, quite frankly, don’t have that in them. If they don’t have a funny bone, they’re not going to work with me, basically. It’s as simple as that.

Victoria Brown (27:06)

Which is great

for you because you don’t want to work with the wrong kind of people, right?

Gus Bhandal (27:09)

Yeah,

yeah, absolutely. Yeah, exactly. And that’s the thing. It’s amazing how many people it’s repelled. And also, it’s amazing how many second rate LinkedIn trainers get irate about it as well kind of thing. it’s very clear that. So for example, I’ve been on a podcast with a couple of like very famous, very popular kind of LinkedIn trainers and they repeat the fact that I’m the UK’s number one LinkedIn trainer, knowing full well that obviously I’m not and they’re much better than me possibly.

We work in different markets and all that kind of stuff. But they’re part of the joke and that’s nice where I get those other LinkedIn trainers that are very much like, who does this guy think he is, et cetera, which instantly tells me that they’re not very good LinkedIn trainers. Because once we start worrying about our competition, we lose sight of where we want to be kind of thing. Run your own race kind of thing. It’s not my problem that you’re not the UK’s number one LinkedIn trainer.

Victoria Brown (28:00)

Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, they need to come up with their own catchphrase.

Gus Bhandal (28:06)

Yeah, absolutely. You know, last year we ran the first Uplift Live, so the UK’s only LinkedIn conference, and one of our speakers was a guy called Richard Van de Blom. Global LinkedIn trainer, very popular, know, hundreds of thousands of followers and stuff like that. And I was the compare, so when I introduced him to the stage, I did say, the only reason my mum says I’m the UK’s number one LinkedIn, no, the only reason my mum says I’m a number one LinkedIn trainer is because she hasn’t met this guy yet.

and then I introduced Richard onto the stage and all that kind of stuff. And obviously he kind of went with the joke and all that kind of stuff. it’s, yeah, it’s good for congruence, brand congruence, I think that’s the main.

Victoria Brown (28:44)

Yeah, so if someone was looking for those callbacks of their own and those catchphrases and those themes within their own business, how would they go about finding them?

Gus Bhandal (28:54)

The theme could be based upon, for example, testimonials that you’ve received. I received one testimony once which said, Gus is the LinkedIn trainer that other LinkedIn trainers use. And I went with that for a little while, for example, because I have trained a lot of other LinkedIn trainers, et cetera. It’s those things. So when you think about what happens in your business, your kind of your clients, the people that you talk to and all that kind of stuff, you know, the callbacks are literally your niche.

your skills, your expertise, get some testimonials from your clients, your ex clients, etc. from the people around you and all of a sudden it will start forming a picture of who you work for, what you’re good at, what your clients think of you, what the people around you think of you, what your friends think of you and all that kind of stuff and all of a sudden it kind of falls into place. Like I said, mine is very jovial because I like to attract people who like humour basically.

But there’s lots of lots of other elements like if you were I don’t know if you were a personal trainer you could you know be based upon who you’ve trained or where you work or you know like a locality or kind of a Testimony that you’ve received or anything like that and it could be based upon your personality your skills your attitude your education etc etc so I think Get other people to say things about you which can then form part of your marketing basically

Victoria Brown (29:54)

Hmm.

a great tip and when I’m talking to you I’m really getting the sense, I mean I don’t know if you’ve done any brand archetype work but I think that your brand must be a jester, I don’t know if it’s something you’ve thought about.

Gus Bhandal (30:38)

⁓ not official brand archetype kind of work, but sure, I’m happy to be called a jester. I yeah, I love that kind of thing. I sometimes wear a silly hat. I can’t do car wheels though. That’s the one that I can’t do. yeah, I’ve never done specific brand archetype of work, but yeah, jester sounds perfect to be honest. it’s, you know, growing up and even now I watch a lot of comedy and because I do a lot of speaking gigs, et cetera.

I like to weave comedy into my into my talks into my presentations and all that kind of stuff because I think Comedians are wonderful storytellers and I don’t mean they’re kind of I don’t mean the Tim Wines of this world where they just kind of like bang bang loads of jokes kind of thing I think it’s more kind of people like Jack Dee, Ramesh Ranganathan, know Ronnie Corbett, for example, Michael McIntyre. There’s all people they tell stories and I think storytelling is really important in business as we said before which then

helps you to create your brand. If you’re really funny, then be funny. You can’t be something that you’re not. I will say, if you’re not funny, don’t try to be funny because it makes it even worse kind of thing. Unless of course you’re trying to be satirical. I mean, I’m sure you’re not old enough to remember Victor Meldrew, but I always tell the story. If Victor Meldrew had a LinkedIn profile, he wouldn’t try and be funny because he’s not. He’s a miserable kid.

Victoria Brown (31:48)

Yes.

Gus Bhandal (32:03)

By being himself, he would attract people like him. And I think it’s exactly that. Whoever you are, be yourself. Whatever your brand… Again, I haven’t done the archetypal work, but I think it’s that whoever you are should kind of filter in through your brand, your work, your storytelling, et cetera.

Victoria Brown (32:04)

you

Yeah.

Mm.

Yeah, so I really 100 % agree with that. It’s so important to be ourselves because you’ll get found out if you don’t. If you try to be something else, something just won’t quite work in a post or something and people just can tell. I can smell it a mile off.

Gus Bhandal (32:35)

Yeah,

yeah, absolutely. You know, it’s a typical marketing cliche for us to say, you know, always be yourself. It’s very easy to say, always be yourself. You know, everybody else has taken. I mean, it’s the one of the world’s worst kind of marketing cliches. However, I’ve kind of I took that in a lot of my talks, etc. I take that one step further to say be intentionally yourself, like actually lean into who you are. It’s all very well just saying, well, this is how I talk and this is my tone of voice and this is the language I want to use and this is what I want to post.

But actually if you lean in to who yourself and again it becomes it comes to that the brand archetype stuff, the storytelling stuff like this is I’m leaning into exactly who I am. So if I’m funny, I’m going to try and be even funnier. If I’m really knowledgeable, I’m going to share even more knowledge. If I want to provide value, I’m going to give even more value. So it’s about being intentionally yourself to then to to almost to really highlight.

the kind of person you are. Because anybody can be themselves, but not everybody leans into who they are, if that makes sense.

Victoria Brown (33:39)

No, absolutely. makes me think of being a bigger and bolder version of you. So if you were a picture on the page, just colouring yourself in even brighter. Picking out those themes and really highlighting on them, rather than trying to talk about everything, pick out those themes because then people will remember who you are.

Gus Bhandal (33:52)

Hmm

Yeah, absolutely. And ultimately, it’s about being memorable. You want people to think of you before they think of somebody else.

Victoria Brown (34:01)

Mm.

Yeah, exactly. I can never go around and say that I love tea because it would be completely incongruous with me as a tea hater, a self-confessed tea hater, and self-confessed don’t really like roast dinners very much. Don’t write in!

Gus Bhandal (34:11)

Hmm. Yeah.

This calls me great, so yeah, so, see, I mean, who doesn’t like roast dinners? I mean, that’s mad. No Yorkshire puddings, no roast potatoes. You know.

Victoria Brown (34:30)

I like Yorkshire

puddings but if I never had to have a roast dinner again I’d be quite happy with that.

Gus Bhandal (34:37)

Wow. You know, I, yeah, I mean, that’s, I want to brush over it, but also I’m going to tell you a My wife and I, like, we have roast, like, not, I mean, you know, probably once a month kind of thing. And I made one last Sunday and I was telling my wife that this stuff takes like two hours, but I like, I eat it within like two minutes. And it’s like, spend all day slaving in the kitchen and peeling potatoes and carrots and peas and making gravy and

Yorkshire puddings and everything else and all that kind of stuff and then I devour it in like two minutes and I think there’s got to be an easier way, do know what I mean? It’s just yeah, it’s you know, so yeah I don’t like making the roast but I do love eating a roast but yeah I can understand why it might not be everybody’s cup of tea maybe, that’s probably the wrong phrase here as well, but you know what I mean.

Victoria Brown (35:19)

Yeah.

Yeah, no. I know, I think that I may have been French in a former

life and I’ve got like French genes in there somewhere. Because I do love croissants. I love croissants.

Gus Bhandal (35:34)

of course, yeah. So it’s… yeah. Yeah, everybody loves…

Yeah, everybody should love croissants anyway, yeah. So I’m not too sure about like, snails… What is it? Yeah, snails and frogs eggs and all that kind of stuff. I’m not sure about that kind of French food, but anyway.

Victoria Brown (35:46)

But they’re, yeah, no, not those.

No, no, but Rockfort

sauce on steak is is amazing. anyway, that my French.

Gus Bhandal (35:55)

⁓ there you go.

Yes, there you go.

Victoria Brown (35:59)

So

in terms of values then Gus, have you ever sat down and thought about your business values and your business purpose and what they are or do you just kind of feel what they are, if you know what I mean?

Gus Bhandal (36:14)

I’ve written lots of stuff down, but me personally, maybe I’ve just never done the right value work. every time I speak to business coaches or anybody that focuses on values and all that kind of stuff, I very much do the work around, know, what words can you use to describe your business and all that kind of stuff. And a lot of the words seem the words that people should use all day, every day anyway. So for example,

My business is very value led. I lead with integrity and honesty and authenticity and all that kind of stuff. And I think although I’ve written those words down somewhere, that filters into the kind of person I am because that’s what I want. one of the reasons I started my business was because I was surrounded by marketing charlatans, people who just, and again, I think we’re seeing this in AI now, for example, everybody just saying, hey, I’m an AI expert. it’s like, are you like,

you’ve literally just kind of you’ve opened chat GPT and all of a sudden it’s kind of like, ⁓ I’m an AI expert. And I think we found that with social media, kind of like years ago, everybody was saying, can help you make an absolute killing using Facebook or Instagram. And then during the pandemic, it was like, ⁓ here’s loads of TikTok trainer. And it’s like, well, I mean, I see it now, you know, I know a couple of people that got like a million views on TikTok. And it’s like, I’m now a TikTok trainer. It’s like, okay, so how much money do you make? And they always say the typical marketing phrase, well, it’s all about brand awareness.

That’s a lot of crap, mate. It’s all about making money. If I were one of your millions tomorrow, I wouldn’t be on social media again. You wouldn’t see me for dust. So we’re on social media to make money. And I think this is what I do, is I help other people do well and learn more from a value-led integrity, authenticity, of honesty-led approach. So although I’ve done the value work, I haven’t really…

It’s just something I feel like it’s just something that should filter through your business. Like we said earlier, you can’t be somebody else. And if you are, you will get found out very quickly kind of thing. So I think that’s the that’s the thing. I’m still on the fence about the whole value led piece kind of thing. I’m sure you’re going to obviously tell me I’m wrong, but that’s it. Yeah, very much so. But it is, you know, I don’t know what my brand stands for. And I know what kind of I what I want people to think when they leave me or when they work with me or all that kind of stuff.

Victoria Brown (38:39)

Yeah,

Gus Bhandal (38:40)

et cetera.

Victoria Brown (38:41)

yeah, I, I, I think that the value work is really important. But I think in your case, I think that you live it automatically almost. No, I don’t think that’s the case for everybody. I think that some people need to be more intentional. So maybe that’s why it comes through.

Gus Bhandal (38:55)

Yeah,

I would agree with that. And again, I think it’s it’s the being intentional with who you are or who your brand is or who your business is or what your business is. And I think it’s that because, like I said, anybody can say, well, I’m honest. And normally when people say I’m honest, it means they’re not. And so I think it’s that it’s that leaning into what do I stand for? What do I want people to think about me? And when I write my content, what do I want them to think about me? Are they going to think?

he’s really funny or are they going to think he’s really professional or are they going to think, I can’t stand his content or whatever it may be. And so the value led approach in your business is not only does it attract the people that want to work with you, but it also repels the people that don’t. I think that’s the, like, you know, like you said, I to a certain extent, I think I live my brand, but yeah, it’s not, it’s not as easy for everybody else. think every business, no matter what business that you should do kind of your value led work.

not just in your business and your brand, but also in your content as well. What do you want to convey in your content? What do you want to kind of come across as? What kind of clients do you want to attract, et cetera?

Victoria Brown (40:02)

I just wanted to talk to you about, mentioned it earlier, the kind of, the perception that people have around professionalism and what they can and can’t say and whether they can be funny and people kind of using professionalism as a barrier almost.

Gus Bhandal (40:25)

Yeah, think there’s absolutely nothing wrong with just being professional or just having the perception of professionality, etc. But I particularly I think if we’re to use social media, because obviously that’s that’s what I do and I help businesses with social media and LinkedIn and digital marketing and all the rest of it is very much about conveying who you are and what you stand for and all that kind of stuff. if, for example, if you’re only writing professional content or if you’re only using

long words and it’s kind of full of jargon and you’re just always focused on your education or letters after your name or you know except what you do for a living and then when people meet you and they think this guy’s like really funny and then you go online and you become really boring again not that i’m saying being professional is being boring there’s two separate things but it’s you know your your persona has to you know be what you know how people perceive you kind of online and and in person and we can use loads of examples like ⁓

Innocent Drinks, Harley Davidson, Red Bull, Virgin, etc. All these companies have a particular brand that they are getting across. know, Audi, &S, Ryanair, for example, they all have a particular brand. that they’re getting across. So it doesn’t, I mean, Ryanair’s content is not professional in any way, shape or form, but they’re still one of the UK’s number one airlines kind of thing. So it’s that.

Being professional is not this, I think it’s all about conveying who you are. think that’s the important thing rather than trying to fit in a box or trying to fit in something that you think your clients would expect, if that makes sense. Cause I think it works the other way around. If you lead from the front people, will, for want of a better phrase, your vibe will attract your tribe basically.

Victoria Brown (42:13)

Yeah and I think you hit the nail on the head there Gus when you said that professional doesn’t need to mean boring and I think that happens the other way around that people think if I want to be professional then they don’t it’s not like they set out to be boring but they think that professional has to be boring and they can’t be fun and by being professional it means that you have to be formal that’s the other thing people think formal, formal and professional they say you don’t have to be formal to be professional.

Gus Bhandal (42:28)

Yep.

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And I think, you know, it’s kind of it’s knowing when to wear a suit and knowing when to wear a tracksuit. You know, you wouldn’t wear a tracksuit to a wedding, but you wouldn’t wear a suit to your local swimming baths, for example. It’s just kind of I don’t know why I thought of local swimming baths. But, know, it’s kind of it’s the it’s the dichotomy of life. And it’s basically just because you’re trying to fit in somewhere that doesn’t mean that you don’t fit in anywhere else. It’s actually you’re just going with this with the situation.

but not at the detriment of who you actually are and what you do and all that kind of stuff. I’ve heard lots of people kind of say, ⁓ you you shouldn’t wear suits or you don’t wear ties because it makes you boring or makes you look professional and all this other kind of stuff. But there are some settings where that’s what people expect and that’s fine. I’m equally comfortable in a shirt and tie as I am in a T-shirt that says free hugs, for example. And I think it’s a lot of people forget that

they’re not mutually exclusive. You can be professional without having to use long words or jargon or just talk about kind of your, you know, what letters you have after your name and all that kind of stuff. I think my content is still professional, although generally it’s incredibly jovial and, you know, mostly your name and all that kind of stuff. But if it’s a content marketing strategy, which gives the air of authority, like when it comes to LinkedIn training and social media management, et cetera, I know exactly what I’m talking about.

And think that’s the, yeah, so being professional is definitely not the same as being boring.

Victoria Brown (44:09)

It all comes down to your audience, doesn’t it? What do they expect?

Gus Bhandal (44:11)

Hmm. Yeah, absolutely.

What do they expect? What do they want to know? What do they see about you and all that kind of stuff? If I started writing content very… What’s the word? content with no humor and very kind of bland content, et cetera, I think people would know that either it’s AI or I’ve been abducted by aliens or something like that kind of thing. So, you know, it’s still, you know, persona-led. But there’s lots of people that agree that I’m the UK’s number one LinkedIn trainer because they’ve had LinkedIn training from me and all that kind of stuff, et cetera. So it’s not.

Just because I say silly things like that doesn’t mean they’re not true and all that kind of stuff. it’s what your audience comes to expect. And again, it’s that personality-led content and personality-led attitude which, when your potential clients think that they need to work with somebody, they’ll choose you over somebody else because of all the other stuff that you write about, talk about, etc. and convey to the audience.

Victoria Brown (45:09)

Yeah, and all those connection points because they might really love cherry chocolate orange juice themselves and it might just help them remember you. Something as weird as that.

Gus Bhandal (45:14)

Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

absolutely. Somebody wrote a post yesterday, actually, saying that they don’t like Terry’s chocolate orange, so I literally just wrote under… I wrote under a post, I said… Yeah, and I put it like as a joke, I just said, like, her name was Karen, so I said, ⁓ Blox Karen goes to shop and buys chocolate orange kind of thing, because it’s just, ⁓ Yeah, some people like it, some people don’t. That’s, you know, that’s fine. It is what it is. And again, it’s all about attracting the people that like you, right?

Victoria Brown (45:43)

Yeah.

Gus Bhandal (45:43)

If people like

chocolate orange then they can work with me. To be fair, even if they don’t like chocolate orange, that’s fine. I tried the one without orange the other day and it was horrible. Don’t tell Terry, but it was disgusting. Yeah, it tasted like really cheap chocolate basically.

Victoria Brown (45:55)

No.

what it probably is, but when it’s with

orange it sometimes tastes amazing.

Gus Bhandal (46:05)

Yes,

exactly, exactly. I agree.

Victoria Brown (46:09)

So I think it’s really interesting you’re talking a lot about being authentic and being yourself and sharing. And we’ve all heard from Brené Brown how we need to be vulnerable when we’re sharing posts. So one of the things that a lot of people come to me with getting their head around is how much to share. So where is, because obviously we’re not gonna be, you’re not gonna be going to the, on LinkedIn talking about the Varukas on your feet because that is blatantly oversharing, hopefully. Most people would see that, hopefully.

So where is the line between sharing and over sharing? And that’s what a lot of people I talk to struggle with. Where do you think that is for you?

Gus Bhandal (46:49)

You know, if you were a podiatrist, you would be talking about Baruchas. So I think there’s a place for every kind of content. I think… So I did a talk last week where I talked about personality versus personable kind of thing. So personal content is not the same as personable content. And this came from like one of the guests that was in the room. She mentioned a podcast.

Victoria Brown (46:53)

Well, yes, that’s true. Yes.

Gus Bhandal (47:18)

from a couple from So and hardly the copywriter was interviewed by Michelle J Raymond the kind of the company paid LinkedIn company pages specialist on a podcast and they were talking about this and It’s something that I often talk about that Just because you have person personable content, it doesn’t have to be personal for example, you don’t have to talk about

your daily ablutions, your bowel movements, the Varukas on your feet and all that kind of stuff. You don’t have to go like really deep, like deep dive into stuff. But the personable content is for example, look, I’m taking my dog for a walk. I’m listening to this business podcast or I’ve read this business book or I’m going networking or I’m on a podcast or I’ve got a testimonial, et cetera. It’s all the bits that make you who you are without delving too deep into, well, you know, I wear a size nine shoes and you know,

got this and I’ve got that this is my dress size and this is what time I went to the bathroom and all that kind of like nobody cares about that kind of stuff unless of course you were a I don’t know some sort of bathroom Tyler or something or I don’t know even then it’s not interesting at all but the it’s the personality led content doesn’t have to be personal and I think I have nothing against personal content and people can talk about that but as long as it fits into a strategy I’ve seen

I mean, I don’t really like dwelling too much on this, but there was a LinkedIn trainer about a year ago who told women that they should tell like the worst stories that like ever the stuff that’s ever happened to them. And I don’t want to talk about the stuff itself because a lot of really horrible stories and like what’s what’s happened to women and all that kind of stuff. And these women were getting like millions of views. We’re talking, you know, and they talk about, I mean, the mildest stuff was cancer stories, basically. And obviously,

Cancer is horrible, right? And so you can only imagine the level of the other stories and then we get millions of views The problem was it wasn’t fitting into a content strategy because everything else they wrote about themselves their business and blah blah I kind of died a death like that. Nobody was interested in that content So there’s no point going viral if it doesn’t fit into your content strategy So there’s that element as well You don’t have to go too personal What you want to do is create personable content that marks you out from everybody else that does what you do

So you can go to Google and type in LinkedIn trainer. There’s a million of them. But if you go to Google and type in the hashtag, the UK’s number one LinkedIn trainer, I’m at the top, for example. But you would have to know the hashtag and you have to know who that person is. But if you type in LinkedIn trainer who wears orange trainers, you know, I’m pretty sure on top of that page as well. And it’s just that it’s what makes you different. So you don’t have to go too deep. It’s entirely up to you how deep you want to go, but I don’t think you need to go too deep. It’s more about

storytelling and conveying who you are and what you’re into and what makes you tick as opposed to the deep dive kind of viral stories that you know just to get engagement because to be honest nobody nobody needs that engagement means nothing the most important metric in our lives is the money in our bank and that should be you know essentially going up if we have the right content marketing strategy using the right channels talking to the right audience

Victoria Brown (50:23)

Hmm.

Yeah, 100%. I think it’s just so tempting for people, isn’t it, to want a viral post because they want the quick fix. They want the easy ticket. And we all know there is no easy ticket. If you want to get fit, you’re not going to get fit going swimming once one time. You need to keep going. showing up.

Gus Bhandal (50:39)

Hmm. Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And you know, the prime example that we can talk about, well, lots of prime examples, but we can talk about when Mike Tyson lost to Jake Paul, for example, or we can talk about the Jaguar rebrand. Lots of people talk like they just go on to LinkedIn and say, I’m just going to say this because lots of people are going to enjoy and like it. You know, I wrote his I mean, I say that I wrote a post about the Jaguar rebrand and it was one of my most popular posts of the year.

But essentially, all I said was, I like the Jaguar rebrand and the only reason I’m talking about it because I’m obviously jumping on a bandwagon because my engagement has been a bit low and it’s one of my highest engaged posts. And most people in the comments completely missed the joke. They were actually saying, well, what do you think about this? And I wonder what their cars are going to look like. And I was just like, I couldn’t care less, mate. I couldn’t afford a Jaguar. I couldn’t care less. could be, know, their brand could be a picture of a tin of chickpeas. I couldn’t care less. Like, it makes no difference to me. And it makes no difference to other people.

But people wanted to talk about it because it’s fine you kind of tap into a zeitgeist and all that kind of stuff but what they weren’t doing was creating the right content for their business. So jumping on bandwagon is not the same as creating content that actually works for your business.

Victoria Brown (52:01)

Yeah, absolutely. But I think you’ve missed an opportunity there because Jaguar are Coventry based. There could be some kind of thing going on there. You could have some kind of brand relationship, I feel.

Gus Bhandal (52:07)

There are a lot of people here.

We could, yeah, I have asked them and they basically said, please don’t darken our door again kind of thing. you know, so yeah, I forget. Well, Aston Martin are just down the road. So I’m going to see if, you know, yeah, I’ve already said to them if they need like a brown James Bond on there.

Victoria Brown (52:25)

⁓ okay.

with an

orange Aston Martin, of course.

Gus Bhandal (52:33)

That would be

amazing, of course. Yeah, yeah. So let’s see what I can do. Go to this space. Or I might just respray my Fiesta. don’t know. Let’s see. Let’s see how 2025 goes. I don’t know. No. yeah. I have a bad car, so it’s pearly on brand. Yeah. But yeah, it’s not orange.

Victoria Brown (52:39)

look forward to it.

Yep. Do you have an orange car?

opportunity.

Gus Bhandal (53:00)

I’ve to be honest, we live on a main street and I said to my wife, because I want an orange car and she said, she said no.

Victoria Brown (53:09)

Sorry about that, husband just decided to barge in and realise I was recording.

Gus Bhandal (53:12)

that’s okay.

He’s welcome to barge in the conversation if he wants. If he wants to come in an orange car, that’s even better. But yeah, because we live on a main street, my wife said, we’re not buying an orange car because then the world and his wife will know that we live on this street and they will start turning up on the door, start knocking on the door and stuff like that. Because what I wanted was actually an orange, fully branded smart car.

Victoria Brown (53:16)

That is not.

Gus Bhandal (53:40)

So was like, I could buy this like a little two-seater smart car, it’d be great. know, like all the estate agents in London do it. Like, let’s just get it all branded up and liveried up. And she said, you do that, go and live somewhere else away from me. That’s not happening. said, okay, fine. yeah. That’s the light. Yeah, I’ve got my brand in neon lights, you know, and I bought a massive kind of like neon light of my brand logo and I haven’t put that up yet.

Victoria Brown (53:53)

Okay, so that’s the limit.

Gus Bhandal (54:09)

I think that’s the extent of where my branding in my house will go. Yeah, nothing outside basically.

Victoria Brown (54:17)

So Gus, you come across as someone that’s really confident, you know who you are, you’re authentic, you’re not to show your true self. But we all know we have inner stories we tell ourselves, we all have things that hold us back and limitations we put on ourselves. How have your inner stories ever held you back?

Gus Bhandal (54:45)

You know, I think when I talk about who I am and what I do, know, marketing is a very, it’s a fine thing. And, know, whenever I meet people that I haven’t seen for a long time, they always say, you know, your business is doing really well, or, you know, you’re really successful, aren’t you? And all that kind of stuff. And I just kind of said, no, actually, it’s just really good marketing. Like, I know how to do marketing. So I market the best of my life, basically. There’s lots of things I, excuse me, there’s lots of things I don’t talk about online.

I generally don’t talk about my wife. I don’t talk about our kid. generally don’t, you know, it’s not like I’m going to give away my home address or anything like that, et cetera. There’s lots of things that I don’t talk about. Simply because they just don’t fit the narrative, if that makes sense. And it’s just like, it’s not really anyone else’s business. However, there are those stories, like I was on a podcast a while ago and, you know, I kind of, I almost broke down because the interviewer said to me, you know, like, what makes you funny? Like why?

do you think you’re funny or what made you funny? And I said, well, actually, when I was younger, it was a defense mechanism. And I think for most people that are really funny, generally, like I was painting a broad brush, it’s because of something else. Nobody is born funny. I think you just learn to, it becomes a defense mechanism where you learn, it’s how you get out of things and all that kind of stuff. And that’s basically what happened to me. So these, when people say, you’re really funny, I kind of just see it as face value.

because if I really started delving into it, it would actually be like an opposite story. So I just take the bit that says, you’re funny. I’m like, cool, let’s stop there because that’s the point. And again, when it comes to marketing, your business, marketing, who you are telling the world, who you are, et cetera, et cetera. And again, it goes back to personable content versus personal content. I don’t need to tell people all the bad stuff that’s happened in my life because it’s shaped who I am, but it doesn’t really

affect other people if that makes sense. I know it’s content that can resonate with others because they might be going through the same things, et cetera. And particularly on podcasts or when I meet people face to face, those kind of stories come out. But as far as a social media persona is concerned, it’s kind of very much focused on a particular content marketing strategy. yeah, particularly when I started my business, a lot of these stories were like, I’m not good enough or I have imposter syndrome or other people are doing better, et cetera.

And I always maintained probably around the pandemic there or thereabouts, I decided I’m not going to use the word competition anymore. I’m not going to say, my competition or my competitors and all that kind of stuff. And when I stopped doing that, my business started to grow because I stopped looking at other people because otherwise I was always, I don’t think I’m good enough, you know, and all that kind of stuff. My nearest competitor, for example, in marketing and social media and stuff used to drive a van.

Whereas I’ve got a marketing degree, I’ve got two postgraduate qualifications, I’ve got loads of letters after my name. But I used to look at him and think, ⁓ he’s got a massive agency and he’s got loads of staff and all that kind of stuff. And deep down, the two aren’t comparable, if you know what mean. It’s very easy to get driven down by your own stories.

Victoria Brown (57:45)

Mm.

Yeah, absolutely, because you’re never going to be the best and you’re never going to be the worst at what you do. You’re always going to be somewhere in the middle.

Gus Bhandal (57:55)

Hmm, yeah.

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. You know, it doesn’t matter how much, how many times you win the Euro million, you’re never going to be the richest person on the planet kind of thing. So it’s kind of, it’s, you know, it doesn’t matter what car you drive, somebody will always drive a better car, you know, et cetera. That’s just, that’s just life. But It’s the old story about the two guys who see the tiger in the jungle, you know, it’s kind of, they’re walking through the jungle and they see a tiger.

And the tiger spots them and thinks, this is lunch. And it starts running towards the guys. And one of the guys sits down, takes his backpack off, takes his trainers out, puts them on. And his mate says, what are you putting your trainers on for? You’re not going to outrun a tiger. He says, I know. I’m going to outrun you. So a tiger will eat you and I’ll leg it. And that’s the story. And that’s how we should treat our marketing. That’s how we treat our business. don’t have to be number one in the world. You just have to make sure you’re not the one eaten by the tiger. basically. So you just have to outrun the people around you.

It’s very easy to be driven down by your own stories and say I’m not number one. Well that’s okay. As long as you’re not last, you don’t have to be first. Does that make sense?

Victoria Brown (59:00)

No, absolutely. think it makes a lot of sense from a mindset perspective because you are running your own race. The only thing I’m curious about is that in marketing, we’re always told to be aware of our competitors. So how do you kind of get around that as a marketing professional?

Gus Bhandal (59:16)

So being aware and following them and keeping an eye on them are two different things. in terms of, I know what my competitors are up to. Some of them are my friends and actually we work together on certain projects, etc. But I don’t spend a lot of time watching them. know, like I’ve unfollowed them on Facebook or Instagram. I unsubscribe from their emails and all that kind of stuff because

I think I’ve got to a point now where I know I’m authoritative in what I do. Particularly when I first started business, I followed all of my competitors and signed up to all their emails and all that kind of stuff. And they used to wind me up because they’ll send me emails and I’ll read them and think, this is rubbish. Like, how are you making money? This is awful. And then I create awful content trying to emulate them and all that kind of stuff. And so there’s a fine balance. Like, I’m aware of my competitors and I’m aware of what they’re doing, but I don’t spend time

dwelling on their content, subscribing to their emails, following them on Instagram, commenting on their LinkedIn content, etc. Because they’re not the people I want to see, basically. The only people I really care about are my friends, the people I’ve built a relationship with, my clients, and anybody who’s willing to give me some money. Beyond that, everything else just pales into comparison,

Victoria Brown (1:00:36)

Yeah, that makes so much sense. it makes it sound like the vision that you’ve got, that’s the important thing. And that’s what you need to keep heading and not looking at someone else. I don’t know if you’ve ever seen it, but there’s an episode of Frasier, which I used to love watching. And he couldn’t ride a bike. And had to ride a bike in this really public race. And he was your top radio presenter. So everyone was looking at him thinking he’s going to be amazing. And he couldn’t ride. And he had to try and learn. And he was on the day he was there doing his race. And he was

he was on his bike going really slowly and he saw this post box and he was like I’m not going to go into it, I’m not going to go into it but because he was focused so much on the post box he was going to it and of course he ended up smashing into it and I just thought it was such a good example of like whatever we’re focused on we’re going to end up doing or heading towards.

Gus Bhandal (1:01:17)

Yeah, yeah.

Absolutely. you know, it kind of reminds me of the analogy of like, for example, Usain Bolt. I mean, I know he’s the fastest, at some point he was the fastest man on the planet. But when, whoever is doing a 100 meter race, they’re not looking side to side. Because if you’re looking side to side, you’re going to veer that way and you’re going to end up being second or third. You know, when you are task focused and you’re looking straight ahead, you only have one goal. And again, if we liken this to business and all that kind of stuff, it’s very much about

your ambitions, your goals, what you’re focused on, what’s your end goal, where do want to be etc. And the only person that can ever achieve them is you. Basically, your competitors are not going to help you do that. Well, not in the fullest sense anyway.

Victoria Brown (1:01:59)

No,

no one really cares about you more than you. It’s sad but it’s true.

Gus Bhandal (1:02:02)

Yeah, absolutely.

It’s absolutely true. the only person that sees 100 % of your content is you. That’s the thing. So it’s kind of, we have to keep telling stories and keep getting out there and keep, but really, nobody cares. It’s about what we can do to make other people care, to make our lives better.

Victoria Brown (1:02:17)

Yeah.

Yeah. And so that vision for you then, where is that? What’s in your vision of the future for your business?

Gus Bhandal (1:02:32)

So the plan is to have a massive orange house, an orange car, that kind of stuff. My whole wardrobe is going to be orange, I’m going to open it, it’s just all orange. Quick decision making and all that. But really, in reality, particularly in terms of my business, I always want to be a company of one. A couple of years ago, that I was like, want a big agency and I want a big office and I want a fancy car and all that kind of stuff. But really, it’s just all periphery stuff, really.

I’m comfortable serving the clients that I can serve from the comfort of my own office and all that kind of stuff. But particularly what’s coming up in my business is I’m starting a of a LinkedIn focused membership. So it’s very much focused on helping a mass of people in one go rather than the kind of the one-to-one training that I do at the moment. I think particularly for me, I think it’s because my business is very much value led, giving people value, making sure people learn.

Etc. I think setting up a membership is very much that old adage of I could give you a fish and you’ll eat for a day, but if I teach you to fish, you’re going to eat forever. My LinkedIn membership is essentially teaching people that they can eat forever. So that’s the short to medium term goal of setting up a membership. The long term goal is obviously becoming incredibly rich so that I don’t have to use social media anymore.

I don’t think that’s ever gonna happen so let’s… Yeah, you’re stuck with me forever, I’m afraid. Sorry.

Victoria Brown (1:04:04)

Brilliant. No, that’s good.

We don’t want you to get incredibly rich and go away because then we wouldn’t be able to be enjoying your LinkedIn posts anymore.

Gus Bhandal (1:04:09)

Yeah, cool. Absolutely,

yeah. Thanks. My wife would disagree, but yeah. No, exactly. Yeah, yeah. It’s overrated. Yeah, yeah.

Victoria Brown (1:04:18)

He wants to be rich anyway.

Thank you so much for coming on the podcast Gus. I’ve really enjoyed chatting to you and finding out because I always wondered about those things in your business and how you came up with them so it’s really interesting to find out. But where can, if people want to know more about your membership and your training and all the things that you do, where can people find you?

Gus Bhandal (1:04:43)

So you can find me as Gus Bandel on LinkedIn. That’s kind of where I do my best work. also if you… So my business is like I said called the DM Guru. And if you just Google DM Guru, the first 10 pages are all about me. But ideally, connect with me on LinkedIn. That’s where I have information about my services, my training, my newsletter, my LinkedIn membership, etc. So yeah, I’d love to connect over there.

Victoria Brown (1:05:06)

Okay, thank you.